You have been warned! The tenant of the future may know more about Landlord Law than you ...

[Vanessa]

I wanted to give the tribe the "heads up" about something I learned recently that I think is vitally important to understand.

 

At the recent West Midlands Property Tribes inaugural meet, speaker Mary Latham gave a brilliant and indepth insight into the reality of being a Landlord and how liability rests with us, and cannot be divested to anyone else, even a letting agents on a fully managed contract.

She also made another very important point:

The tenant of the future will know more about Landlord Law than you.

This is because of the availability of information on the web.  Mary said that there are actual forums and discussions groups being set up that solely focus on how to use the law to the tenant's benefit.

Mary told the amazing story of a Landlord who tried to deduct £15.00 from a tenant's deposit for "dust on the skirting board" and "a dirty net curtain that needed a wash".  This ended up costing him in excess of £20,000 in legal fees.

Along with Mary, I urge all Landlords to educate themselves as to the law and their responsibilities.

Remember, in the past, people had to pay for information.  Now, thanks to the web, it is all free.  Tenants are using this to their advantage and will take advantage of you if you are not treating your Landlordism like a business and understanding your responsibilities.

Above everything, Mary wanted us to understand that the tenant is allowed "quiet enjoyment" of their rental property.  This law supercedes all other laws and charges of "harrassment" by the Landlord are very serious and can lead to litigation costing thousands of pounds.

Remember, the price of ignorance is alot more than the price of education, and NONE of us can afford it.

You have been warned! 

Further reading:  Is your Landlord back covered?

If you would like to brainstorm other traits of the tenant of the future, the landlord of the future, the finance of the future, and the lettings agent of the future, then please come and join us at the Great Landlords Brainstorm at the Property Investor Show.  Mary Latham is on the panel and we expect it to be a really productive, informative, and entertaining session.  Tickets are selling fast, so reserve yours now!

[Tessa Shepperson]

Mary is quite right, landlords are heavily regulated and should take care to find out what their obligations are before they set up as a landlord.  You can get an agent to deal with renting your property for you but YOU wil still be legally liable if your agent gets it wrong.  

 

Tenants are becoming more knowing, although the availability of information on the internet does not necessarily mean that people will read it!  It is best though to always act on the basis that your tenants will know what their rights are and act accordingly.

 

I also agree with Mary about the covenant of quiet enjoyment.  It is a fundamental right of tenants - I explained this here on my Foundations in Law series on my blog: http://www.landlordlawblog.co.uk/2011/06/14/the-six-most-important-...

 

If you want to be able to enforce your rights against your tenants, it is important that you have complied with all your legal obligations first, otherwise, as Mary says, you may have difficulties.

 

Tessa Shepperson

Solicitor: www.landlordlaw.co.uk | www.landlordlawblog.co.uk

[Vanessa]

Thanks for commenting Tessa.  I appreciate your input as always, and thanks for reinforcing the importance of this topic.

[John Corey]

Vanessa,

 

I think it would be fair to say that some tenants and some landlords will know the law. Others will not.

 

There is no reason that a person could not learn the rules and regs other than they choose not to do so. Having such a choice will continue even with the web.

 

Maybe it would be better to say that some will be left further behind, tenant or landlord.

 

John Corey
Follow me on Twitter-> www.twitter.com/john_corey
www.ChelseaPrivateEquity.com/blog
London RE meeting, 2nd Tuesday of the month -> meetup.com/real-estate-advice

[Vanessa]

Hi John,

Fair enough.

But the web makes information free and allows people to communicate and share information like never before.

Before the advent of Web 2.0, tenants had to pay for legal advice and could not join forums with other tenants to share their experiences.

I think it would be wrong to dilute the importance of this thread.  I hope Mary Latham will come along and elaborate later as she had examples of where this was happening.

None of us can afford the price of ignorance and I will always encourage best practice.

I don't think a single Landlord in this country can afford to bank on the hope that tenants may not research and find out information and their rights on-line.  That would be very foolish indeed to run a business on a "hope" that the tenant will remain in ignorance  - especially as there is so much information on-line and tenants are wising up to finding it and using it.

[Edward Tudor]

Hi Vanessa,

 

I learned about this when I had to take my first tenant to court to be paid after the DTS paid him the deposit back with no reference to me even though I had supplied them with all the information on the damage done - TWICE.

 

The government and the country needs private landlords and yet all they seem to do is punish them for providing a service that the country can no longer provide now that the council house stock has been sold off.

 

Sorry for the rant.

 

[Vanessa]

It's good to rant! :)

Agreed, Edward.  Thanks for commenting.  I have just had to concede on a number of deposit issues because the tenants would not budge or compromise in any way ... and it would have gone to TDS dispute .... and I would have automatically lost ... so I just had to take it on the chin.

Many LL's who stick out for "principles" finds out it costs them an awful lot in the end.  Sad but true.

[John Corey]

Vanessa,

 

How are you defining web 2.0? I have been a member of forums before there was a web and tenants were using similar facilities.

My point is the web is not educating just the tenants. Take the NLA accedadation program or other programs that operate on the web (partially or entirely).

 

You noted that you were worried about the importance of the thread being watered down. That will happen if we drift into unsubstantiated opinion rather than sticking to the facts. Education benefits both. Both will find it easier with the web compared to traditional forums that pre-dated what I think you are calling Web 2.0.

 

Education is important and people should understand what they are doing independent of if they are a tenant or a landlord. It just makes good sense (& cents).

 

On the later point where you backed down, I am not sure what you mean by "and I would have automatically lost". Why would you automatically lose? 

 

When Susanne posted a list of arbitration settlements you could see examples of the tenant winning or the landlord winning. In almost all cases where the landlord lost, it was an own goal. The biggest issue was the lack of documentation at check in and check out so the landlord claims could not be substantiated. Technically the deposit is the tenants money unless damage or other losses could be proven. An assumption that the tenant is right unless the landlord can demonstrate otherwise. I note that Edward's case does demonstrate that not every settlement is correct. I just know the bulk in the list shared by Susanne showed a clear pattern when the landlord lost.

 

John Corey
Follow me on Twitter-> www.twitter.com/john_corey
www.ChelseaPrivateEquity.com/blog
London RE meeting, 2nd Tuesday of the month -> meetup.com/real-estate-advice

[Vanessa]

Thanks John.

I just think too many landlords are lethargic about understanding the law and their obligations.

Did you know for instance, that it is illegal for the Landlord to hold a set of keys to the property?  You can hold a set of keys if you get the tenant to sign an agreement to that effect and attach it to the tenancy agreement.  That is the only legal way to hold keys.

If a tenant knows this, and the LL doesn't, they could cause mayhem for the LL and use it against the LL in any dispute that arises over the tenancy.

Ref:  Deposits.  I had to have a flat re-decorated and tried to charge the outgoing tenants one third of the cost - splitting the costs between myself, the previous tenants, and the leaving tenants.  They refused point blank to contribute.  They had been there a long time, but, ironically, the TDS would have found in favour of the tenants as it would be called "fair wear and tear".  I had all the inventory and documentation, but the letting agent advised that I would lose if I tried to challenge it.

[John Corey]

Vanessa,

 

Thanks for the reply.

 

1. I did not specifically know about the keys. I do not keep keys. I do tend to believe the tenant has the right to quiet enjoyment so completely agree with the point underlying why the landlord needs permission.

 

Tangent: If a landlord does not have the correct permissions and approval to rent a place an eviction can be overturned. The landlord might then have to pay back up to a years rent to the tenant as the landlord was not able to offer the tenancy in the first place. Is this something landlords understand when they do not get permission from the mortgage holder, the freeholder or others? Will a judge always allow such a defense? No.

 

2. Deposits. I would agree with the tenant on this. The landlord is being paid monthly for wear and tear. I am used to the cost of a repaint being a landlord's issue after 2-3 years. What is reasonable wear and tear is a bit og a gray area so not so easy to figure out. 

I have the view that anything that can be done to extend a tenant's stay plays to the landlord as you reduce the upkeep. You get to the point where it makes a lot of sense to repaint the place and there would be no expectation of the tenant contributing if they have been there 'long term'. 

 

So, I am on the side of the tenant in the examples given. A few too many landlords think ownership implies the right to control the property. The law is clear in the UK on this matter even if the landlords are naively wrong. If more tenants actually understand the law I think it could reduce the headache for the landlords who do operate within the law.

 

John Corey
Follow me on Twitter-> www.twitter.com/john_corey
www.ChelseaPrivateEquity.com/blog
London RE meeting, 2nd Tuesday of the month -> meetup.com/real-estate-advice

[John Corey]

The following might be more in the spirit of an educated consumer (tenants) shifting the balance of power. I have no connection to the webinar. I just received the promotional email this afternoon.

 

If someone wants to listen but can not make it live they will send the audio.

 

Competitive Strategy in the Age of the Customer

 

The text from the email which is not on the page on the website follows. The speaker is from a respected research firm that is not focused on one specific sector.

Full description: Empowered customers are disrupting every industry and traditional tactics can't save you. The only sustainable advantage is your relationship with your customers. Companies that master customer data flow and provide a superior experience will win.   Join us for an interview with Josh Bernoff, SVP of Idea Development at Forrester Research, Inc. and author of the influential report Competitive Strategy in the Age of the Customer. You'll learn the key trends and tactics to gain the competitive edge and grow your business.   See you on the call!   The Get Satisfaction Team   p.s. Can't make the call? Go ahead and register and we'll send you the recording.

 

John Corey
Follow me on Twitter-> www.twitter.com/john_corey
www.ChelseaPrivateEquity.com/blog
London RE meeting, 2nd Tuesday of the month -> meetup.com/real-estate-advice

[Adrian Thompson]

Vanessa said:

...

Did you know for instance, that it is illegal for the Landlord to hold a set of keys to the property?  You can hold a set of keys if you get the tenant to sign an agreement to that effect and attach it to the tenancy agreement.  That is the only legal way to hold keys.

...

Hello

I've had a little flurry of members contacting me about the above comment. Could you provide the Act of Parliament, Regulations or case law to which you refer please?

Many thanks

Adrian

[Vanessa]

Hi Adrian, and welcome to Property Tribes.

I heard this from Mary Latham, who is a trainer for the NLA.  I will ask her to comment where this information comes from to bring clarity to this matter.